Easy to fix GW.
Really easy.
Give them Carapace, give them T4, make them 70 base, give them all HnR, make Melta Bombs a general option for 5/model. 125 points, 5 Cavalry, 2 melta, 5 MBs, HnR, tougher than average IG stats. Make them WS4. Give them Scouts, make Kamir give them Infiltrate.
How's that?
9 comments:
bit of a random rant for you???
and some of it i would agree with. but you have to remember that they are only useful in their first charge. after that they are nothing more than cannon fodder.
HnR would be a nice thing to have, but you have to think aboout the realism of that when dealing with horses.
in real life, a mounted charge doesnt retreat after a charge.... it continues the charge through the infanty. and as much as some might think, 40k does have a realism element to it, so HnR wouldnt work.
no arguements on them needing Carapace Armour
Infiltrate with Kamir??? are you serious? do you really think you could infiltrate Horses in reality???
besides the man already has a few special rules. and he also can have up to 7 attacks on the charge (6 if it is the first charge, cant get an extra CCW attack if using the Hunting Lance)
T4?? they are still Guardsmen and i dont think they deserve it, despite the fact they have Horses. Horses are flesh and blood and if you compared RR with Marine Bikes, the Marines only get the extra Toughness value because they are on a metal machine.
the RR could use a 6+ Invulnerable because the horse could bite the bullet instead
and i would agree with Scouts and possibly WS4 cause it does take a skilled rider to fight on horseback
WS4 - Yes
T4 - No
Melta Bombs - humm, maybe sargent only
Special Weapons - Yes, but limited
Scout - Yes definately!
I love rough riders, well, Death Riders of Krieg more specifically, and with such nice models availible its a shame that their stats are so rubbish!
A bit much I'd think.
Of course, a lot of the stuff already in the IG codex was a bit much!
I could see carapace and scouts for a price increase. Keep in mind that Scouts would also let them Outflank, which makes them really scary.
Don't see a need for stat increases or Hit & Run.
An option for mounts for characters could be fun, let a commissar or something ride along with them.
Shit one. I typed a lengthy reply, quoting page 44 of Codex:IG in particular to fluffily justify Scouts and even Infiltrate.
Suffice it to say, the Internet ate it.
Regarding WS4 - they should be better than regular Infantry in CC.
Regarding T4 - a T boost brings them in line with EVERY other Cav model in the game.
Regarding SpecWeps - they weren't something I changed.
Regarding Cost - While a unit of 5 may seem like a really solid deal as I described, you are still competing with 5 other very solid options, including Vendettas. Plus, the cost of additional bodies didn't go down.
Kamir is crap, cf. rage USR.
Hit and Run doesn't let them reuse the Lance, so they're pretty dodgy at it. Still, fairer, given their role.
Actually Death Korps, medieval knights would charge repeatedly until they broke the infantry line assuming the first charge didn't work.
Rick, i never said that the couldnt use Scouts. infact i said that they could use it, being that they are scout units.
but i dont agree that they deserve Infiltrate, and nowhere do i read on page 44 that the RR infiltrate in anyway. it says, and i quote, that RR "act as Scouts, Patrols, and Fast Response Troops."
i agreed with the WS4
and i will stick by what i said on T4. the Marines, and Ork bikes, and Eldar Jetbikes get an increased 'T' value because they are mounted on Machines that can soak up some of the fire being poured into them.
RR only have Horses....Horses arent Machines, they are flesh and blood, exactly like the rider on top.
would you expect a horse to survive a Bolter round as well as a Marine bike could??
No...no you wouldnt.
and as for HnR, it isint worth giving to RR. yes it says on page 44 that thats their prefered tactic, but in game i dont think its worth it.
and Nike that may be the case for Medieval Knights, but they didnt have much in the way that could stop from charging again and again.
heres an example of what would happen if 5 man squad of RR charged a 10 man squad of Chaos Bezerkers.
they charge and they kill about 5 Bezerkers, and the Bezerkers kill 2 with their attacks back. then under the hit and run rule they roll their inititive test (which tbh your going to lose most of the time. i have only won 2 Inititive test with my Guard in 2 years of gaming).
if the test is one you then move 3D6" to run away, and say you get 10", was a really bad roll for example. this allows the Bezerker squad to move closer and shoot then charge you. that squad would be destroyed by those 5 Bezerkers in 1 go.
if you got a decent roll and the bezerkers couldnt touch you in CC, those RR could still be shot to pieces in the shooting phase by a HB, or autocannon.....or god knows what.
if it survives that and you get to charge again....what do you have to really frighten your enemy with??? your no longer Inititive 5 and you no longer have power weapons. the bezerkers attack first and, tbh, the RR are more likely to die before they can attack.
tbh, i would prefer that the RR stay in combat just to avoid being shot at by other people and it ties up a squad of bezerkers for a turn, maybe 2....which tbh, i would prefer, cause that squad could charge something else that i wouldnt want it to charge.
also as i said before, the RR are only useful in their first charge of the game. otherwise, as said, they are expendable....
Yep, rarely useful. Still should be there for fluff.
Also, "able to function for extended durations behind enemy lines"
but if it should be there for fluff sake, your just adding points to a unit that really isint worth the points to begin with.
and that means that they should have Infiltrate? all that means is that they are good a scouting, and sustaining themselves away from supply lines.
to infiltrate you need to sneak up on your enemy without alarming him of your presence. you just cant do that with a horse. horses get spooked very easily, and can be very noisy.
besides, do you really think GW would allow RR to have infiltrate in game?? if you get first turn, you can charge your opponents best unit and knock it out of the game no matter how bad your fleet move was, since Cavalry have the 12" charge range.
the unit would be unfair for that reason alone.
and if it were me making up the rules for RR, and i had to choose HnR or Infiltrate....i'd pick HnR everytime, because its the fairer choice. (but i'd rather not pick either of them at all if i had that choice)
Only if by 'charge your opponents best unit' you mean 'You leave my best unit unshielded on foot in Infiltrate+Scout range of an enemy going first with S5 Power Weapons and Dual Melta...you deserve this, idiot.'
:P
Also, see 'cannot be easily detected by Auspex or scanners' - they set them up for Infiltrate, and yet they can't do it.
Future Horses don't spook. ;)
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